Trying to avoid Monsanto?

[curly_kate]

There was a seed cleaner interviewed in the movie Food, Inc. He goes around to farmers with a machine that will clean their seeds for them so that they are easier to save & plant. Apparently, Monsanto is suing him because they accuse him of "abetting" farmers in saving seeds and therefore violating their contract with Monsanto, even though he doesn't have any idea what kind of seeds the farmers are using. THAT is the kind of thing I don't want to support.

 

[seedcorn]

Curly, Ducks......don't know what you do for a living (don't want to know) but put yourself in breeders place.

Spend 10+ years developing a new line, only to have someone buy 1 seed, multiply it and sell it (trade it, whatever) to someone else. THEY profit off of your WORK......seem fair to you????
It's easy to say "it's a huge company" they are evil but who paid for the research? Who paid the breeders salary, his health insurance for his family, et? Think they make too much? Can they set how much you are allowed to make? or what conditions you have to work under? Seed cleaners are just as guilty as they are "get away" driver for the heist. I'm in Ag, the concept "he has no idea what type of seed he's cleaning" is funny......on so many levels. That's why movies are not to be taken serious as most of the time, they take "liberal" license to twist the facts, have to sensationalize it or NO ONE would buy/watch the video.

Open pollinated seed is very genetically diverse. As a general statement they don't produce as much and are more subject to diseases. For "home" garden, may not be big issue(could be better in taste, value), but for commercial farmers, while improved varieties are WAY more expensive they pay for themselves w/productivity.

 

[Reinbeau]

The discussion isn't about seed dealers going out of business, it's about one company monopolozing germplasm so as to lock anyone else out of the market. There seem to be several, if not many, independent seed houses that are doing just fine keeping genetic lines going without the 'help' of a big corporate overlord. Monsanto has been defeated on several fronts due to their business practices, I can only hope they continue to be whacked down when they apply their overreaching business methods to control a market.

If you all want to read one fight and defeat (if you hadn't heard of it already) check this link which chronicles Percy Schmeiser's battle with Monsanto and their genetically modified seeds. Great stuff, I'm happy he was able to stand firm and win in the end.

 

[seedcorn]

The discussion isn't about seed dealers going out of business, it's about one company monopolozing germplasm so as to lock anyone else out of the market. There seem to be several, if not many, independent seed houses that are doing just fine keeping genetic lines going without the 'help' of a big corporate overlord. Monsanto has been defeated on several fronts due to their business practices, I can only hope they continue to be whacked down when they apply their overreaching business methods to control a market.

If you all want to read one fight and defeat (if you hadn't heard of it already) check this link which chronicles Percy Schmeiser's battle with Monsanto and their genetically modified seeds. Great stuff, I'm happy he was able to stand firm and win in the end.

They are ONE and the SAME. Have to understand the battle before you can take on a solution.

Understand, for companies, sometimes it's cheaper to just pay off than fight for your rights. Are courts/juries always correct? See OJ story.

Let me try to explain again w/a question. IF you developed an engine that ran on H2O, would you want people to use this technology w/out paying for it? When you ran the gas powered engines out of business, would there be an outcry about how evil this man/company was putting the oil based industry out of business?

Again, don't like a company, don't buy from them. Support people/companies that do business the way you want. Don't steal genetics tho......someone spent their life developing that line.

 

[seedcorn]

The discussion isn't about seed dealers going out of business, it's about one company monopolozing germplasm so as to lock anyone else out of the market. There seem to be several, if not many, independent seed houses that are doing just fine keeping genetic lines going without the 'help' of a big corporate overlord. Monsanto has been defeated on several fronts due to their business practices, I can only hope they continue to be whacked down when they apply their overreaching business methods to control a market.

If you all want to read one fight and defeat (if you hadn't heard of it already) check this link which chronicles Percy Schmeiser's battle with Monsanto and their genetically modified seeds. Great stuff, I'm happy he was able to stand firm and win in the end.

There are? name them in the soybean, field corn, wheat, alfalfa, vegetable business that actually breed lines. It is SO expensive to breed, multiply, promote new lines that only a handful can afford it. It's even harder for an independent breeder as people will multiply it themselves and NOT PAY the royalty to the breeder.

 

[Rosalind]

IF you developed an engine that ran on H2O, would you want people to use this technology w/out paying for it?

Speaking as a Big Huge Mega-Pharma scientist, I feel pretty qualified to say that if I did not have a business model in place to guarantee a decent return on investment for a patent and development proposal, I would not invest in such a technology. This is how capitalism works, I'm afraid. Many inventions DO collect dust in a patent office filing cabinet for this reason.

There are other ways to develop a technology that, by itself as a standalone invention, would not generate a good ROI: You can use it as a loss leader, you can use it as a platform development project (develop a system that will also work for other, more profitable technologies in the future), you can do a less-expensive pilot scale and outlicense the development side and share marketing rights, you can sell it to a government entity (not necessarily USA) or NGO who is willing to fund it. But yes, as a matter of fact, these types of decisions are made early on in the R&D process, and they are a major reason that, for example, not much R&D is performed in India even though they do have plenty of qualified technical folks for the job and cheap cost of labor--crummy IP protection.

When you ran the gas powered engines out of business, would there be an outcry about how evil this man/company was putting the oil based industry out of business?

Most likely yes, now that you mention it. Exhibit A, American SUV manufacturers getting a $$zillion$$ bailout.

If Monsanto gets into a field where they find out after the fact that they have crummy IP protection in general and then discover that they have invested more in a technology than they can recover, that would definitely be Monsanto's problem. I have no sympathy for their lousy business decisions, just as they have no sympathy for mine.

 

[seedcorn]

In Ag, a company can not even test new technology w/out serious safeguards, Government oversight, & HUGE risks. #3 seed breeder in USA developed a new line. Some of the seed got out of their possession. Result...independent people found that there was a possiblity that less than 1% of the population MAY be (not that they were) sensitive to it--they were put out of business. The gene they selected for, is still being eaten in other products today.

 

[ducks4you]

I believe that everyone should have the right to create and profit from copyrights. That being said, I believe that Monsanto is an organization out of control. I have been a horse owner for almost 25 years, and a chicken owner for about 5 years, and I live on AG 2 zoned acreage. Therefore, NAIS is a "fur-raising" topic at my house. In case you are not familiar with it, and with Monsanto's involvement, please read below, with the link and quotations from it.
National Animal Identification System (NAIS) plan that's being pushed by USDA
http://www.dairygoatjournal.com/issues/84/84-6/Heather_Smith_Thomas.html
"How did the NAIS evolve?
This ambitious project was spawned by the NIAA (National Institute for Animal Agriculture), a self-appointed group made up of many organizations involved in animal agriculture, including some of the largest corporations (such as Monsanto, Cargill Meat, National Pork Producers) and many manufacturers of high-tech animal equipment (Allflex, Digital Angel, Global Vet Link, Micro Beef Technologies, etc.). Some of them have a vested interest in a national animal ID program because it will ensure more markets and higher prices for their meat or for ID equipment."

In this bad economic market and with our government giveaways, the climate for pushing this legislation is not currently favorable. They've been trying to cajole us into registering our chickens with the government in case of an avian flu outbreak for almost one decade now. I first read about them in a 2007 IL Equine periodical. They want us to buy marking apparatus and force registration of every SINGLE animal that we own, and this would include baby chicks, and every community, and that would include the Amish. The cost of equipment and the cost of registration would put small animal breeders out of business, and significantly increase the costs of the backyard livestock owner unnecessarily. I just wanted to clarify that I believe that this grossly inflated company does not simply want to be rightly compensated for their agriculture contribution. They are interested in participating in a money grab. Please read and let me know what you think.

BTW, if YOU invent a new plant/seed, I'll be more than happy to pay your royalties.

 

[Texan]

In this bad economic market and with our government giveaways, the climate for pushing this legislation is not currently favorable.

Actually, the Global Warmist have been popping up for the last year with studies on how our pets and personal farm animals are "effecting our climate" They are going to try to attach a tax to our animals.

They've been trying to cajole us into registering our chickens with the government in case of an avian flu outbreak for almost one decade now. .

This is going to be how they track our animals so they can tax us. Of course your government will grow because this will require more government jobs to accomplish this.

I will get off of my soap box now because I am skirting the rules here a little bit with the political talk.

Happy New Year Everybody!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[ducks4you]

Texan, I think we're okay, because I'm not trying to argue anyone into becoming a "Whig" or a "Torry," as they used to say back in the 1700's.