Colony Collapse Disorder....Honey Bee Decline

[boggybranch]

http://www.motherearthnews.com/natu...campaign=HE&utm_source=iPost&utm_medium=email

 

[Collector]

HMMM! the plot thickens, If the scientists are having trouble detecting the source of the problem it must be pretty serious. I see some of what Jimw was saying about the transporting of bees all around the country could be contributing to CCD. Maybe beekeeping is going to have to become more localized ie; backyard bees.
Boggy thank you for posting the link it was interesting to read.

 

[JimWWhite]

In the past few years, researchers have pointed to numerous potential causes of CCD, and many of those have been disproved or reconsidered. Is CCD a particularly difficult case to solve? If so, why?
It is difficult to solve because it doesnt leave bodies for autopsy the bees of most interest disappear. The movement of more than a million colonies of bees across the nation and back and forth through agricultural lands makes tracking almost impossible.

OK, someone's going to get me on a rant here if they keep it up. The above was taken from the Mother Earth News article previously mentioned. One thing that strikes me is that the person writing this article appears to be one of those 'The Sky's Falling, The End of the World is Coming' reporters who doesn't want the truth but wants to stir people up and get them foaming at the mouth over their pet cause of the moment. Look, if you go out to your hive and it's empty and there's a pile of dead bees beneath it or on your bottom board screen, then there is a problem. A real problem. Something killed the bees very quickly. This would have to be a pesticide or a microbe. But if there's no bee bodies and no evidence of mites, foul brood, varroa, etc. then the hive probably just gave up and moved on or just diminished out of existence. It only takes a few weeks for that to happen to a weak colony. I'll bet most amatuer beekeepers probably don't open up their hives and go all the way down every couple of months or so just to see whats going on inside. Do they check on the queen? Is she even there? Are there queen cells at the bottom of the hive body's centermost frames? Are there a lot of drone cells? These are things that an experienced beekeeper looks for and will do something about. I'm not saying that CCD doesn't happen because it does. Does it happen to the average beekeeping operation either commercial or hobbiest? Perhaps. But I'm betting that what a lot of amateur beekeepers are reporting as CCD is just that the hive petered out because it just got weak and wasn't properly cared for. Did you know that certain times of the year you need to feed bees because of a dry spell, too cold, etc. I still believe the biggest problem with CCD is with the big commercial operations that put 200+ hives on flatbed 18-wheelers and haul them all over the country which puts a tremendous stress on the bees. Stress, changing diets, pesticides, diesel fumes, not being properly cared for... these are all triggers for CCD in my opinion and in the opinion of most of the beekeepers in our local association. So instead of crying and wringing your hands about the pending doom of civilization, why not just go out and tend to your hives like you're supposed to. And if you don't have a hive join your local beekeeping association and learn how to and then set up your own hive. You'll find there's a lot of people out there who are more than willing to help you get started. And you'll find out about an extremely interesting hobby and help our world at the same time.

 

[boggybranch]

In the past few years, researchers have pointed to numerous potential causes of CCD, and many of those have been disproved or reconsidered. Is CCD a particularly difficult case to solve? If so, why?
It is difficult to solve because it doesnt leave bodies for autopsy the bees of most interest disappear. The movement of more than a million colonies of bees across the nation and back and forth through agricultural lands makes tracking almost impossible.

OK, someone's going to get me on a rant here if they keep it up. The above was taken from the Mother Earth News article previously mentioned. One thing that strikes me is that the person writing this article appears to be one of those 'The Sky's Falling, The End of the World is Coming' reporters who doesn't want the truth but wants to stir people up and get them foaming at the mouth over their pet cause of the moment. Look, if you go out to your hive and it's empty and there's a pile of dead bees beneath it or on your bottom board screen, then there is a problem. A real problem. Something killed the bees very quickly. This would have to be a pesticide or a microbe. But if there's no bee bodies and no evidence of mites, foul brood, varroa, etc. then the hive probably just gave up and moved on or just diminished out of existence. It only takes a few weeks for that to happen to a weak colony. I'll bet most amatuer beekeepers probably don't open up their hives and go all the way down every couple of months or so just to see whats going on inside. Do they check on the queen? Is she even there? Are there queen cells at the bottom of the hive body's centermost frames? Are there a lot of drone cells? These are things that an experienced beekeeper looks for and will do something about. I'm not saying that CCD doesn't happen because it does. Does it happen to the average beekeeping operation either commercial or hobbiest? Perhaps. But I'm betting that what a lot of amateur beekeepers are reporting as CCD is just that the hive petered out because it just got weak and wasn't properly cared for. Did you know that certain times of the year you need to feed bees because of a dry spell, too cold, etc. I still believe the biggest problem with CCD is with the big commercial operations that put 200+ hives on flatbed 18-wheelers and haul them all over the country which puts a tremendous stress on the bees. Stress, changing diets, pesticides, diesel fumes, not being properly cared for... these are all triggers for CCD in my opinion and in the opinion of most of the beekeepers in our local association. So instead of crying and wringing your hands about the pending doom of civilization, why not just go out and tend to your hives like you're supposed to. And if you don't have a hive join your local beekeeping association and learn how to and then set up your own hive. You'll find there's a lot of people out there who are more than willing to help you get started. And you'll find out about an extremely interesting hobby and help our world at the same time.

VERY good "take" on the article from someone who, obviously, has hands on experience. Just what I was hoping for. THANKS

 

[Ladyhawke1]

Call me a cynic, for that is what I am. Sweetheart, the sky is falling, and not only on the bees. Fish stocks are down 90% and commercial fishermen are also looking at the bottom of their nets just like the bottom of the beehives.

Ewwww...is here a trend here or is it just our imaginations. I can hear it now......quote..."Why do I care, I don't eat fish." Why should I care either...I don't eat honey. Ahbut do we know that almost one third of our food supply is only grown with the help of bees, bats and birds.

It's all the same when people don't care. Nature is not finite. We all know that, it is that is unthinkable that nature maybe collapsing in our lifetime and not in some distant future.

 

[hoodat]

It strikes me that in almost every investigation of the problem pesticides and herbicides seem to be "off limits". They somehow always come up with some other explanation - or should I say speculation since they never seem to come up with a definitive answer.
Pesticides are meant to kill insects. Bees are insects. To think that a pesticide will kill one type of insect and not harm another is ridiculous. Prominent on the label of any herbicide is a warning for you to avoid contact with it. If it is harmful to you can it be harmless to bees?

 

[JimWWhite]

Now I don't want to give the impression that I'm protecting pesticides. I'm not. They're not allowed on my property and I've gone to my most immediate neighbors and I think I've convinced them not to use them as well explaining that it may affect our bees. I can't do anything about the larger family farmers in the area even though I know my bees may be going out to 2-1/2 miles to forage and that covers a lot of area. Pesticides may very well be playing a role in CCD but as I've said the members of our county beekeeping association have not been seeing cases of CCD here. I'm not aware of any of them being the big operators who truck bees all over the country. At most I know of a couple or so beekeepers who do take hives up to the mountains in late summer to let their hives forage on sourwood trees. Bees are very sensitive to pesticides. Some of the chemicals can kill off a hive overnight just by accidental release of them. But then you'd find a large pile of bees beneath a hive if that happens. From what I've read about it CCD is a collapse of the colony where the hive appears to just fizzle out and all you find afterwards is a perfectly good hive with no bodies to figure out what happened. Sometimes there's even full frames of honey they've left behind.

 

[simple life]

"OK, someone's going to get me on a rant here if they keep it up."
Why would this get you on a rant??
You mean someone posted a link to a popular topic?
Who was and what were they keeping up?

While there are alot of theories going around NO ONE knows for sure exactly what the cause or causes are.

I personally feel its a combination of things going on and creating the perfect storm so to speak.
Its pretty obvious that commercial migratory beeks put a big strain on the bees and that has been stated in several published articles its not just club chatter.
However, I would also never discount pesticides/herbicides or microbes regarding ccd, nor would I the commercial beekeeper or even the hobby beekeeper who feed their bees genetically modified corn syrup and toss all kinds of chemicals into their hive that can weaken a colony and it's future offspring as the brood is exposed to the toxins and other things they would normally not come across in their foraging and are not capable of handling.
What about the genetically engineered crops that the bees forage on?
Lets not forget that the bees themselves have also been played around with in labs to create a bee that has this or that going for it.
Queen bees are artifically inseminated now on a regular basis to control the genetics and alot of original traits have been lost.
You can only control nature so much before it backfires and that goes for all livestock and crops.

Also what exactly do you consider "amateur"?
That is the first time I have heard that expression used in relation to beekeepers.
I would assume that amateur refers to all beekeepers that are not
professional beekeepers who earn a living from beekeeping and can support themselves.
If not and you are referring to "new" beekeepers I think you are making an innacurate sweeping generalization on how none of them seem to know how to inspect their hives or manage their bees properly and are reporting ccd in their hives.
I usually find the opposite when new beekeepers get their first hives.
They are very enthusiastic and want to check their hives constantly and especially to look for the queen.

Not sure what you consider amateur/new beeks, correct me if I am wrong but didn't you just get your first hive this past April?

Its great to be excited about beekeeping but lets not get overzealous and critical with our opinions, there is room for everyone's take on the CCD situation.

To my knowledge, ccd isn't when the bees just weaken and fade away, its when a beekeeper has bees one day and they are literally gone the next.
Commercial beeks are professionals and have employees so I do not believe that they are not inspecting their hives and are missing all the signs of a weakening colony and mislabeling their disappearance with ccd.
Also, there is a big difference between commecial beeks and migratory operations.

While I have always believed that the commercial migratory beekeepers put alot of strain on their bees I do not believe that is the only thing going on.
There have been reports of feral hives that are being tracked by scientists up and dying very quickly as well.

So instead of crying and wringing your hands about the pending doom of civilization, why not just go out and tend to your hives like you're supposed to. And if you don't have a hive join your local beekeeping association and learn how to and then set up your own hive.

I really don't think that is going to solve everything and the reality is that not everyone can go out and get bees.

Alot more has to change in this world.
Some people are in the position to make more changes than others, some will keep bees but toss 100 plastic water bottles into the trash this year, some will recycle but inject their livestock with hormones, some will raise organic livestock but drive a gas guzzler all over town every day, some will drive a hybrid car but own a company that dumps toxic waste into the ocean, some will....... but....
Again, a combination of things creates the perfect storm for anything to go wrong. Greed, laziness and passiveness have gotten us to where we are today.

Anyway, its not just the bees.
There is decline with the bats, birds, fish etc. so if someone wants to go ahead and scream the sky is falling they have my permission.

It draws attention to the problem.

 

[JimWWhite]

Natalie, your points are well taken, especially your analogy of the perfect storm. It's not one thing. It never is. It's probably actually closer to 6 billion things but that's something that won't change until God or Mother Nature or whoever gets fed up and wipes the slate clean and starts all over again. And yes, I am an 'amateur' and I'd never pass myself off as an expert. I guess I'm an enthusiatic amateur. My goal in all this is to point out what we've been talking about here in our local association and share the info being given to us. It's always a hot topic of conversation but when the moderator asks when someone starts talking about CCD if anyone present has witnessed it or knows of anyone who has, the answer is always 'No'. We have about 50+ members and maybe a third of them are professional beekeepers who do make a living or some portion of their living off of bees. The rest are like me who are 'amateurs' who have one to five hives in the backyard and give most of their honey away to family and friends. Some may sell their's at the local farmers' market each week. I don't know if that makes them professional though.

Jim

 

[hoodat]

I'm not sure whether it's a local or a wild hive but there is sure a thriving hive somewhere near me. I get more bees all the time lately and last year I even had a swarm fly over my back yard. Even in this cold wet weather the bees are busy on the chinese broccoli and mustard I let go to flower for their benefit.