2023 Little Easy Bean Network - Beans Beyond The Colors Of A Rainbow

heirloomgal

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I wonder if the Kartoffelbohne tastes like potatoes. Yummy. And coincidentally, the outcross that I grew out from Rio Zape produced some black beans-- and some with a seed coat that is very similar to the Kartoffel bean! It was a semi-runner.
This is so interesting @Branching Out . I looked around a little after reading your post. It does seem like Rio Zape and Hopi Purple String are synonymous. However, when I grew those beans they all turned out perfectly uniform with that deep rose with the black streaks, so that is odd because Hopi Purple String is a mix? @Bluejay77 this been originates with you, what has your experience been?


So then I looked for Hopi Purple String independantly, and found this?
Seems to look like your beans, and even more strangely it's like the mix of contained genetics is sort of spilling out in your garden? Not only have black seeds shown up but these new ones. What are the chances that there was a cross in your plants that turned out to look just like the diversity in Hopi Purple String? What are your thoughts, cross or Hopi genetics? It would be quite a phenomenon if you grew these beans again and got the gold seeds. Then I'd really be convinced that something in your garden is triggering the plants to express these seemingly hidden genetics...
 

Blue-Jay

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@Bluejay77 this been originates with you, what has your experience been?
The bean seems late here but I have never gotten any off types from it. Maybe that is because it might be blossoming at a slightly different enough time than the other beans that I have grown around it.
 

Beanmad Nanna

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because of the Pledge as currently written i will not knowingly grow any OSSI Pledged varieties.

The OSSI pledge reads: "You have the freedom to use these OSSI-pledged seeds in any way you choose. In return, you pledge not to restrict others' use of these seeds or their derivatives, by patents or other means, and to include this pledge in any transfer of these seeds or their derivatives."

my issue is that i cannot possibly know which beans i grow are derivatives since i let bees openly pollenate all my beans. :(

if you only grow OSSI pledged seeds then you are covered in terms of any derivatives, but if you have any of your own varieties and you don't want to get tangled up in OSSI Pledge license issues then you'd have to isolate 100% with 0 errors... um, i don't think nature works very well that ways.

since i have put years of effort into the various beans i've named and released i have no intention of ever getting tangled up with OSSI. :(

i also have no license that goes along with the seeds i give out. they are open pollenated and can be potentially crossed with many dozen of the different beans i've grown over the years. also my sources are not always knowingly giving me clean varieties so they may also be crossed and contain off types. i can't give assurances and i don't care to do any other paperwork than what i already manage to get done.

ethically i hope that anyone who takes one of my unique varieties that i've crossed and worked with to get it fairly stable will give me credit but i have no control over the beans once they are out of my hands. some people may and others may not.
thank you for this clarity. That's clearly problemmatic, when misread it as 'OP no ties' - and have long thought that the case. Ummm thinks again. :(
 

Blue-Jay

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Khabarovsk - Pole Dry. It's been since 2015 that I have grown this Russian in origin bean with any good quantity. So I thought I would renew it's seed this year. Another variety that had a tough time with the weather. It has beautifully red splashed pods but the summer went by so fast I never seemed to notice the pods this year. Harvested only 1 ounces of beans (28.3 grams)

La Pap Black Outcross - Pole Dry. I don't usually get interested enough to keep another black outcross when I find one. I've had lots of them over the years. This one is very plump and it produced so well in this cruely dry summer that I will grow this one again. Likely it might be stable from the start as black is a dominate color trait. Seed mother is La Pap. total seed harvested from two plants 10 ounces (283 grams)

Khabarovsk.jpgLa Pap Black Outcross.jpg
Khabarovsk - Pole Dry...........................................La Pap Black Outcross - Pole Dry
 

Blue-Jay

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because of the Pledge as currently written i will not knowingly grow any OSSI Pledged varieties.

The OSSI pledge reads: "You have the freedom to use these OSSI-pledged seeds in any way you choose. In return, you pledge not to restrict others' use of these seeds or their derivatives, by patents or other means, and to include this pledge in any transfer of these seeds or their derivatives."

my issue is that i cannot possibly know which beans i grow are derivatives since i let bees openly pollenate all my beans. :(

if you only grow OSSI pledged seeds then you are covered in terms of any derivatives, but if you have any of your own varieties and you don't want to get tangled up in OSSI Pledge license issues then you'd have to isolate 100% with 0 errors... um, i don't think nature works very well that ways.

since i have put years of effort into the various beans i've named and released i have no intention of ever getting tangled up with OSSI. :(

i also have no license that goes along with the seeds i give out. they are open pollenated and can be potentially crossed with many dozen of the different beans i've grown over the years. also my sources are not always knowingly giving me clean varieties so they may also be crossed and contain off types. i can't give assurances and i don't care to do any other paperwork than what i already manage to get done.

ethically i hope that anyone who takes one of my unique varieties that i've crossed and worked with to get it fairly stable will give me credit but i have no control over the beans once they are out of my hands. some people may and others may not.
@flowerbug has hit all the issues of OSSI seeds perfectly for me. I couldn't have verbalized it any better. I wouldn't want to get entangled in this web.
 

flowerbug

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...Seems to look like your beans, and even more strangely it's like the mix of contained genetics is sort of spilling out in your garden? Not only have black seeds shown up but these new ones.

the black ones may be a reverse.


What are the chances that there was a cross in your plants that turned out to look just like the diversity in Hopi Purple String? What are your thoughts, cross or Hopi genetics? It would be quite a phenomenon if you grew these beans again and got the gold seeds. Then I'd really be convinced that something in your garden is triggering the plants to express these seemingly hidden genetics...

i love beans. :)
 

Branching Out

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This is so interesting @Branching Out . I looked around a little after reading your post. It does seem like Rio Zape and Hopi Purple String are synonymous. However, when I grew those beans they all turned out perfectly uniform with that deep rose with the black streaks, so that is odd because Hopi Purple String is a mix? @Bluejay77 this been originates with you, what has your experience been?


So then I looked for Hopi Purple String independantly, and found this?
Seems to look like your beans, and even more strangely it's like the mix of contained genetics is sort of spilling out in your garden? Not only have black seeds shown up but these new ones. What are the chances that there was a cross in your plants that turned out to look just like the diversity in Hopi Purple String? What are your thoughts, cross or Hopi genetics? It would be quite a phenomenon if you grew these beans again and got the gold seeds. Then I'd really be convinced that something in your garden is triggering the plants to express these seemingly hidden genetics...
I stumbled across a page that mentioned Hopi Purple String Beans as the favourite of a Washington farmer named Zac, https://www.friendsofthefarms.org/blog/tag/purple+hopi+string+beans

The photo of the beans includes all three of the types of seeds that I have ended up with including rosy pink, black, and black on grey. So I if they are indeed synonymous with Rio Zape I am leaning towards Hopi genetics at this point. That would make a lot of sense. :)
 

heirloomgal

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I stumbled across a page that mentioned Hopi Purple String Beans as the favourite of a Washington farmer named Zac, https://www.friendsofthefarms.org/blog/tag/purple+hopi+string+beans

The photo of the beans includes all three of the types of seeds that I have ended up with including rosy pink, black, and black on grey. So I if they are indeed synonymous with Rio Zape I am leaning towards Hopi genetics at this point. That would make a lot of sense. :)
I think so too @Branching Out . My guess is that someone especially liked the rosy pink beans and kept replanting only those with each subsequent generation, until the grow outs were yielding only rosy pink beans. Possibly those other seedcoat expressions, though, remained buried in the genes. It's curious nonetheless why that *stability* is getting undone in your garden. Growing conditions maybe? I have not replanted Rio Zape since my first grow out because I got such a good crop, but I'll definitely keep this in mind when I do replant them. I'll be curious to see what variables may show up.
 

Blue-Jay

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Libra - Pole Lima. This is one of my early started beans. As maybe you can recall from two years ago. This bean is a segregation from a cross with Ping Zebra. I tried starting 4 seeds of this bean and wound up with only one single plant. It did not segregate. It was true to itself. I wonder if that would continue into future generations by planting only it's seed. Could it be stable already. I will find out next summer. This one single plant was terrifically productive producing 16.50 ounces of these gorgeous beans (468 grams).

Logan Giant - Pole Snap. I grew one single pole of this bean this year to see what their eating quality was like. I might have had about three plants. Nice stringless tasty snap bean. A genuine West Virginia heirloom. Once I had my taste test experience I left the rest of the pods the plant produced, produce dry seed. Harvest 7.25 ounces of dry beans (205 grams).


Libra.jpgLogan Giant.jpg
Libra - Pole Lima........................................................Logan Giant - Pole Snap
 
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