~ HAS THE WORLD GONE MAD...? New madness ?? ~

[Rosalind]

Interesting that Johnson & Johnson just had a major security break w/their drugs from slave labor countries & not drugs made in USA.........go figure.

This is incorrect, sorry--their problem was with medicines manufactured in Ft Washington, Pennsylvania (just outside Philly) at their McNeil facility. From what the FDA citation says, they were hiring unskilled labor untrained in the relevant regulations (21CFR) and giving them no particular instructions, buying any white powder labeled with the chemical name whether it was that chemical or not, not running their equipment correctly, they were previously cited and knew that they had issues but sat around on their thumbs and did nothing, they had complaints from consumers and STILL sat around doing nothing, the QC lab fudged its numbers even though they knew that some batches had almost no drug in it and other batches had a lot more drug in it (due to unskilled labor not running the mixers properly), access to labels was not controlled (any fool could label anything "Children's Tylenol" whether it was that or not), their QC sampling technique was poor, many of the raw materials had bacteria and mold growing in them, equipment was uncalibrated, equipment was filthy and covered in dust and crud & held together by duct tape, there was junk lying all over the place, water from the plumbing was filthy and undrinkable and was being used to make product.

And yes, this was in the US, in a Philly suburb. I happen to know of a vaccines plant in that area, different big pharma but same region--had some colleagues who worked there. They reported similar issues, although not nearly that bad, and the place was eventually shut down. Apparently if you are looking to hire scientific & pharma management in the Philly/south central PA area, you'll get a lot of scumbags; there's a lot of people whose qualifications look great on paper but in real life are pretty awful. From their perspective, I'm one of those Massachusetts techie snobs who gits up on her hind legs and tells the menfolks what to do.

But now you see why I don't trust anything, even that which is made in the US. They were making children's medicine with random crud they bought from some shady character out of East Armpit, Nowhere, mixing it up with water straight out of the Delaware river, stirring a 2000 gallon vat with a teaspoon and calling it good. That's a lot of screwing up by a lot of people, not a few bad actors! That sort of thing doesn't happen without a lot of deliberate foolishness and sociopathy, you've got to have a lot of hate to feel OK about selling this to children. And I don't mean the little brat down the block who eggs your house and pesters your dog, I mean random children, some of whom are probably even good kids. Lots of people in the company had to know about this and think it was peachy-keen. I keep harping on that, but this is not something that can be explained away by a lame HR screening procedure that lets a few bad apples through--this is humanity being basically evil.

 

[seedcorn]

So don't apologise to me -- it doesn't help anyone!

The reason I apologise is because of my part of hi-jacking a thread, not for my views.

I understand people's views that it's the "Big, Bad Companies" doing it to us. I just don't agree. It's us doing it to us or more personnal, me doing it to me. I'm also very sensitive (since it affects everyone I know) to products imported from slave labor countries. If they lived by environmental standards, labor laws, safety laws, etc, I'd have no problems. Then it would be compete or lose to us.

I don't blame companies, I blame people. If I know them, I blame them personnally for their views/actions.

 

[seedcorn]

Rosalind, thanks for the info. CNN reported as I typed. I hope they hang ALL the people involved, starting w/company CEO. Plant manager, purchasing agents should end in jail at the very least.

 

[Hattie the Hen]

seedcorn wrote:

Slave labor countries use heavy amounts of chems that are illegal in USA, use labor that have no environmental concerns, & of course the concept of OSHA/labor laws is lost on them. USA ag products compared to slave labor ag products is infinitely safer and environmentally more friendly. Yet, we the American public, continue to support them and rail against our own. Remember the fresh tomato problems--came from slave labor countries NOT THE USA.


Please have a look at this article & all it's links, throughout the pages.

http://www.gourmet.com/magazine/2000s/2009/03/politics-of-the-plate-the-price-of-tomatoes



Well this article certainly does not support your point of view. I, myself, saw some of the terrible conditions that migrant labour lived & worked in while I was visiting California. I saw the planes spraying the crops & the workers with only scarves over their mouths to protect them & I also saw a surprising number of small partly deformed children......!! It shocked me profoundly. I had strayed from the main highway in search of something to eat......!! I visited local food stores & was amazed at the very high prices being charged -- very much higher than San Francisco where I was working. It certainly looked as bad as a very poor 3rd World country to me.

Hattie

 

[lesa]

Oh, Hattie, I am afraid the answer to your question is "yes", the world has indeed gone mad! So sad that all this craziness affects our food. Of all the things to mess around with....Keep gardening everybody!

 

[Southern Gardener]

Might want to re-think that line. The senate--a bunch of paid whores....

USDA is not the problem, it's lack of. Plus if Americans would STOP buying 3rd world produce, 2/3 of the problem will go away. The USA produced food is not the major problem, it's the imports--cheap, slave labor.

Everyone wants to blame the companies who make the chemicals & not the PEOPLE who buy them, use them, and sell the contaminated products back to us at below market costs.

We control our own destiny w/our dollars. We need to stop blaming others and put our dollars where our talk is.

I guess you DID NOT read the last article. What did you NOT understand?

As for your remark that Americans should stop buying third world foodwe are only offered what we are offered at the local grocery store. Those that do not have access to any home grown food are screwed. What planet do you live on?

Im like most other Americansm make the choices BASED on what is offered. I can not go into a store and NEED coffee and only be offered Folgers and Maxwell house. If I do not HAVE the choice of the 3 option of 'fair trade shade grown' coffee then how can I make my voice heard?

Now, I have to say I am quite impressed with Walmart. They are actually a GOOD example in this situation. They have increased the amount of organic they carry BECAUSE the customers are ever increasing the purchasing of organic, so walmart is pushing out less attractive brands and cuting costs on organic to sell more. They have announced they will only be carrying eggs from cage free birds in their store... not because its nice and humane though... but because studies show IT IS WHAT THEIR CUSTOMERS WANT!

If walmart gets it and the US government doesn't its because they are turning a blind eye!

I shop at Wal-mart and the only thing I've ever found orgainc are carrots. Last week I paid $.88 for a bag and this week they are $1.94!!! If they do sell more orgaincs they must be hidden or don't offer them in Louisiana!

 

[seedcorn]

Ok, read the article. So we have employers (private citizens, not companies) exploiting people in USA.....nothing new. You will find them everywhere in the world, call them pimps, whores, prostitutes, drug dealers, etc.

I have no problem w/anyone employing workers to not employ undocumented workers. I also agree as end of article stated, look at labels, buy seasonal fruits/vegetables when they are in season, buy local, buy American. Did you miss their conclusions?

Again, your article implies that American food is infinetly safer than 3rd world countries food, by telling you to buy American. Doesn't mean it's always safe but much safer. If people want to do some good, start a campaign against 3rd world countries to stop slavery, abide by environmental laws, child work laws, OSHA, etc. Instead people like to rail against those that are at least trying.......stomping on ants while elephants run free in their house.

We fought 2 wars to stop slavery. If people want to get out of slavery, do what we did, fight. In the article it stated that the law officials were handicapped because the supposed "slaves" wouldn't testify. Who's fault is that? Do as some have in this thread, blame the police? yeah right.

 

[Ladyhawke1]

What is there about this world that some people do not get? If you never stray from your front door, read or let your natural god-given curiosity move you to investigate the world you live in and you just accept the right wing pabulum as truth.then you lose.

First, we bring ALL food production and manufacturing goods back to this country. Second, we then enforce the laws that are already in place. WE hold the FDA, OSHA and Congresss feet to the fire. Third, we stop blaming and criminalizing ordinary everyday people from inside and outside of this country for the problems here. That is a damn cop out and much too easy to do. It is a divide and conquer strategy and it works best on the ill informed.

If one knew anything and it has been planned that Americans are not served well by their mediathey would understand what the WTO, the World BANK, NAFTA, AND GATT policies have committed our country to third world practices. These issues are more than fifteen years old and almost unheard of by most Americans

These very same third world practices that are now affecting this country. It took just fifteen years for the everyday public to now barely understand the results and effects on them.

These policies in order to SERVE the WORLD BANK, WTO and other treaties have made this countrys sovereignty non-existent, and they are now showing their ugly results. Let me make it simple for you. First, look up the word sovereign, it means self-governing.

In order to serve the moneyed forces in this world this country as it has happened to other countries .this country MUST set aside its environmental and safety laws in order to be able to trade goods freely across borders. This country has no say in its very own laws, and that we must abide by the tribunals that are set up by these other world moneyed interests or be charged massive debt.

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines01/0705-03.htm

If you do not read or understand the BIG wordslook them up! Note how old this article is and is you say that is old.then I would be glad to update you.

So.when do we as a people working side by side say enough is enough? It is really a wonderful concept that we all try to make our own little islands of survival by growing our own food. However..as they say No man is an island. We need each other and our strengths. What you do not understand about your world, could kill you.

Some corporations are bigger than most nations. These oppressive practices are put in place to make corporations richer and Capitalism has no conscious, it exists only to make a profit, and at any cost. Look at BP and the Gulf of Mexico. I predict that this catastrophe is going to affect us all and they ( when I say "they" I mean corporations ) will try to make it look small and insignificant. It is NOT.

 

[seedcorn]

Parents must be made aware of their responsibilities for their childrens' health & they must influence the school's choice of food sold/given to them. quote from Hattie

Here is where the problem started and ended. People stopped being parents or being responsible for their actions/results. It's not the governments, companies, evil world controllers..........it's us. As another poster stated, companies, governments did the survey's, found out what we wanted, gave it to us. Now we've got it and now understand we don't want it. Old saying be careful what you wish for because you might get it.

 

[Ladyhawke1]

And some people practice being obtuse. :/