2022 Little Easy Bean Network - We Are Beans Without Borders

capsicumguy

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I have never put a limit on number of varieties someone can request to grow.

Thanks. My garden size and the consternation of my co-gardeners (wife and mother-in-law) will put an effective limit on the number I'll request :D My big concern was that, in the 2021 thread, I thought I saw a conversation between you and another Canadian about confiscation at the border if the package was more than x number of seeds?

Sometimes I get a new grower and they request a ton of varieties and wind up being one of the best growers I've ever seen and return everything they had success with. I have others that request lots of varieties and I never hear from them again and when I email them and they never respond.

That's kinda tragic. Wonder why some people never respond. I suspect that, for some of them at least, they don't want to tell you about a crop failure, eh? Even if you've explicitly said that mistakes happen, and you just want to know either way (I think I read that somewhere), some people prob just have a hard time moving past the shame.

As for snap beans on the Priority List that I can be very sure of that would be Fox Family Greasy, and the Kjoto. Suppossedly the Aeron Purple star will make a snap bean also. The rest I believe are all dry beans.

Thanks. Are all greasy beans generally meant to be eaten at snap stage?
 

Blue-Jay

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@Bluejay77 is Cranberry Fleider the same as Forelle Fleiderfarben?
I believe that Cranberry Fleider is likely the same bean. I think Forelle Fleiderfarben translates as Cranberry Lilac. The British have a bean also called Cranberry Lilac looks exactly the same and FF and CF. There might be other names in Europe for this same bean.
 

Blue-Jay

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Thanks. My garden size and the consternation of my co-gardeners (wife and mother-in-law) will put an effective limit on the number I'll request :D My big concern was that, in the 2021 thread, I thought I saw a conversation between you and another Canadian about confiscation at the border if the package was more than x number of seeds?
All you have to remember is no more than 50 packets and no more than 50 seeds per packet. I will mail you all the paperwork you need for a seed return. You can put 10 seeds in the second packet that I will send but don't try putting 50 seeds in the seond packet. I talked to inspectors at the Linden, New Jersey examing station and he told me a second packet of the same variety needs to stay withing a certain weight limit. If you go over that limit on the second packet they will simply remove some of the extra beans to get it within their weight limit. The inspector told me what it was but I don't remember what the weight amount was. 10 seeds in the second packet won't go beyond their weight limit. If you really want to send more beans and you want to give me your email address by PM. I can tell you about another method that has been used two or three times from growers in Canada that you won't have to worry about the paperwork and so far has worked. However I always wonder if there will be that certain moment when it won't work and U.S. customs people will destroy the packages contents.
 

flowerbug

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since we are talking about regulations and i've been contemplating this more i was trying to decode this Canadian website page:


from what it looks like to me if i am sending a package of beans to Canada:

- as long as the package is less than 5 kilograms (large seeded beans sized less than 200 per gram).
- as long as the beans are clean of weed seed varieties and there are no other contaminants (dirt, treatments or other things like fertilizer or fungicide type coatings).

then no import fee or paperwork is required.

as long as it is a one-way transaction i do not think i need anything else. i don't think anything else on that page applies to what i would be doing.

am i right? :)
 

capsicumguy

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For those others who, like me, are bean neophytes, I've compiled what I could find on the priority list. All data copied verbatim from @Bluejay77 with my additions in bold. Any seed that's already listed on Russ' website is marked with ABCW.
  • Aeron Purple Star - Pole Snap Purple Podded Runner. Phaseolus Coccineus, typical black/brown/purple seed coat pattern of scarlet runners
  • Andikove - Bush
  • Baby Green Lima - Bush
  • Black Bandy - Pole Lima, vigorous climber, heat tolerant, green to purple at shelly stage turning to black when dry. 85d
  • Brazil Little Black - Semi Runner
  • Brown Lima - Pole Lima
  • Candy F9 Outcross - Likely a Semi Runner
  • Cranberry Flieder - Pole, speckled purple horticultural/cranberry
  • Dalmatin - Bush, I know there are a couple beans named Dalmatian; @Bluejay77 is this your own named variety (ABCW) or the synonym of Jacob's Cattle?
  • Dean Family Greasy Cutshort - pole snap (likely), seeds tan with brown speckles
  • Dule - Unknown Growth Habit possibly a Pole
  • Duilius - Pole dry. Large yellow seeds (ABCW)
  • Etna - Bush Horticultural or Cranberry type, standard for commercial production apparently
  • Fox Family Greasy - Pole Snap, white seeds
  • Fukuryu Chanaga - Bush, dry, horticultural/cranberry with few pink markings, productive (ABCW)
  • Hidatsa Shield Figure - Semi Runner, dry, white with tan/brown patch around eye, productive
  • Ilene - Pole Snap, couldn't find anything except there's a surprising number of people out there named 'Ilene Bean'! :D
  • Kjoto - Pole Snap, white seeds (ABCW)
  • Luther Family Greasy Cornfield - Pole, white seeds (ABCW)
  • Mutazione Di Monachella, pole, dry, white with spotty maroon patch around eye, egg-shaped (ABCW)
  • Nassieddu - Pole, dry, white with small black soldier spot (ABCW)
  • Nassieddu Viola - Pole, dry, white with speckled red soldier spot (ABCW)
  • P-Town - Pole, dry, brought from Basque region to Provincetown, MA, US in '30s and grown as a heirloom there since. May be related to 'alubias pintas alavesas'. Red with white speckles.
  • Pink Striped Greasy - Pole
  • Ruth Bible - Pole Snap, light tan seeds
  • Santa Maria Pinquito, semi-runner, dry, pink to light brown, central California heirloom, holds texture well when cooking
  • Serrano - Only 7 seeds left - Growth Habit Unknown
  • Striped Bunch - Bush Snap, may also be semi-runner? tan seeds with brown stripes
  • Tuvagliedda Rossa - Pole dry, white with maroon/red speckled patch around eye
  • Trevio Nun - Semi Runner dry, looks like Orca/Calypso but with dark oxblood colouring
  • Sulphur - Bush, same as China Yellow on ABCW?
 

capsicumguy

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If you go over that limit on the second packet they will simply remove some of the extra beans to get it within their weight limit.

oh good, so it sounds like even if there are small mistakes they won't toss out the whole shipment.

So if the limit per shipment is 50 packets with 50 seeds in each, and the expectation is to send back 60 seeds of each variety, that's a limit of 25 varieties... I think I'm only gonna do about six varieties, so I'm well within limits ;)
 

capsicumguy

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I wonder if you crossed BRG with a bean that is noted for creaminess (Hutterite Soup comes to mind) you get one that basically makes its own vegan beef soup?

ha, that'd be fun! I was describing in the previous thread that there seemed to be a fair bit of variability in cooking times among the different sizes/colours of beans. The ones that got overcooked were nice and creamy.
 

meadow

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I wonder if you crossed BRG with a bean that is noted for creaminess (Hutterite Soup comes to mind) you get one that basically makes its own vegan beef soup?
It sounds like Carol Deppe achieved an even beefier version. Beefy Resilient Grex resulted from an accidental cross between Gaucho and Black Mitla (a tepary bean). When BRG crossed BACK to Gaucho, she wound up with her "Beef-Bush" lines. She says that the black one is her "all-time favorite dry bean." Here is what she says about the backcross:

I was just minding my own business not trying to be a bean breeder at all when my heirloom ‘Gaucho’ beans, supposedly P. vulgaris, crossed so cheerfully with ‘Black Mitla’ tepary, supposedly P. acutifolius, to give me material that I in due course released as ‘Beefy Resilient Grex’. I was still not trying to be a bean breeder when I subsequently got several dozen unsolicited backcrosses of those crosses onto pure ‘Gaucho’. The backcrossed plants were obvious by their generally short viney bush type, purplish plants, and usually black or brown seed. One of these backcrossed plants produced 806 seeds, the most I have ever got from any legume. Really, what could I do? I saved the seed separately, of course. This plant, named “Resilient 800X’ became the foundation plant for the Beef-Bush series, derived by selecting for bush type and pure colors.

I'm placing her explanation about how BRG came to be behind a spoiler so that those interested can read it, but hopefully it won't be a big giant wall of text for everyone else. ::fingers crossed this works:: [It didn't work, so here ya go. Sorry for the length.]

Beefy Resilient Grex excerpt: This is a segregating population of beans that represent the F6 and F7 of crosses between Gaucho common bean X Black Mitla “tepary.” (Note: Black Mitla has long been listed as a tepary, but its flower anatomy is intermediate between what is expected of P. vulgaris and P. acutifolius. I am guessing Black Mitla, an heirloom from Mexico and popular in the Southwest, actually resulted from a cross between the two species.) Gaucho, an Argentine heirloom, is a very early, very delicious richly flavorful gold dry bean. Black Mitla is a widely adapted bean with a powerful delicious flavor. Both are small beans round in cross section and about twice as long as wide. Both are easy to thresh. Teparies are unusually heat resistant and drought hardy, and are resistant or tolerant to diseases common beans succumb to. Common bean varieties tend to yield more. In 2009 I was trying to do seed increases on the pure varieties, which I grew only 12 feet apart; they shouldn't have crossed if they were different species. In 2010, when I grew out what I expected to be pure gold Gaucho, about 5% of the plants produced black seed. Figuring that whatever the exact species identity of the parents, the cross was immensely interesting, I hand-sorted out several thousand black seeds representing those crosses and planted them in 2011 to produce Resilient Bean Breeder F3. These turned out to be the most productive dry beans I have ever seen. When I cooked up a pot of the mixed colors, the flavor blew me away. The beans taste more beefy than beef does. When the mix of all colors of beans proved so delicious just as is, I renamed the material Beefy Resilient Grex. The 2016 population is F5s and F6s from the original crosses. The plants are a mix of short-vined bushes and true bushes, mostly the short-vined bush types. They all hold their pods up off the ground and can be handled like bush beans. To harvest I clip or pull plants and roll up the tangled row-shaped mat of beans. About ¾ of the beans are black; the rest are brown, tan, gold, or speckled. Maturity is a little later than Gaucho but still quite early. (Presumably there will be continuing segregation for plant type, maturity, drought resistance, disease resistance, and bean color and flavor.) I am selecting gently for earliness (by eliminating any plants that are not dry along with the main crop) but not selecting otherwise.
 

Blue-Jay

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So if the limit per shipment is 50 packets with 50 seeds in each, and the expectation is to send back 60 seeds of each variety, that's a limit of 25 varieties... I think I'm only gonna do about six varieties, so I'm well within limits
Yes that would put a limit of 25 varieties.

Anyway I will send you all the return packets with labels printed and fitted inside ziploc baggies. One packet marked at 50 seeds and the second packet marked at 10 seeds.

Your package from me will contain a list of all the countries I import beans from which also identifies my USDA import account number, and a package inventory list. All those papers you will include with your bean shipment. I will also include a mailing label for the Linden, New Jersey inspection station. Use that label to mail your package to them directly. Not to me. They will forward your package after inspection to me.

All they are looking for is uncleaned beans, soil and insect pests. Don't include and pod particles or soil from your garden. I'm sure you probably would do that anyway. I only say this to be clearly specific.

Also included in your package from me will be a Yellow/Green USDA shipping label that is barcoded. This label is to be sealed in clear tape and placed somewhere on the outside of your bean return package where there is room for it.
 
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